Huffyuv problems

[hmpf]

Having given up on achieving any really precise result in Windows Movie Maker (it keeps subtly de-synching my finished vid when I render it), I am now trying to get started working with Premiere Pro 6.0. Premiere doesn't like my source avi files, so I asked around a bit and people told me to use VirtualDub to convert my source to an avi that would be usable by Premiere, and to use Huffyuv to encode/compress/? (arrgh, I need to learn vidding terminology!) Now, I've played around a bit with the program and the codec, and so far I have two problems:

1.) The file size is *huge*. For a clip of around 1500 frames it can be between 500 and 700 MB. This could turn into a big problem for me soon, as my hard drive really isn't that big. I have around 18 GB free space at the moment, could possibly expand that to around, hm, 30 GB.

2.) The clips play very jerkily, as if a lot of frames are being dropped.

Anyone know what to do?

Comments

[chasarumba.livejournal.com]

Huffyuv is a good codec for quality (it's lossless), but not great for compression -- it creates smaller files than uncompressed AVI, but that's not saying much. It's what I've always used, but I had an external hard drive for clips when I was vidding on a laptop, and now I have a desktop with two large hard drives...in your situation, it may not be the best option.

There are many other codec options out there, though. Hopefully you'll get some suggestions about those with better compression. I know Lagarith is another high-quality codec option, but it probably also produces very large files (dunno, haven't tried it).

As far as jerky playback, do you mean after you've rendered out in Windows Media (or whatever) *after* editing, or are you trying to play those clips in your preview monitor in Premiere or in another media player? I would guess that playback issues would be due to the huge filesize and your computer not being able to keep up.

Jerky playback

[hmpf.livejournal.com]

I tried to play the avi I had produced with Huffyuv in VirtualDub in my standard media player (Zoom Player), and it was jerky there. I don't think it's due to my computer not being able to keep up, as I tried another clip I had produced in VirtualDub using another high quality codec, which was also very large yet played just fine. And the clip in question was 'only' around 500-700 MB in any case; that's big, but it shouldn't be a problem for my computer, I think. (1.47 GHz, 256 MB RAM)

Re: Jerky playback

[chasarumba.livejournal.com]

If you find a codec alternative, you won't need to bother with this...but I would try importing a jerky clip into Premiere and rendering it out in decent quality Windows Media -- if the clip plays smoothly once rendered, you'll know it was just a playback issue and not any actual problem with the clip itself. Huffy is primarily an editing codec and not designed for playback...my laptop had similar specs to your computer and it definitely dropped frames if I tried to just play a clip.

Re your comment below, the reason to edit in very high quality is so that you can eventually produce a variety of different renders (in my case, both DVD and online distribution versions)...edit at full quality, compress at the end. This became important to me over time -- I definitely didn't worry about it much with my first couple of vids or I would have been too frustrated to continue.

Re: Jerky playback

[hmpf.livejournal.com]

- Importing it into Premiere etc.: okay, will try. But if I want to work with the clips it won't do to have jerky clips, because I won't be able to judge the timing before rendering the vid... or do you suggest rendering each clip in wmv *before* I start editing the vid?
Anyway - will play around with the clips in Premiere a bit...

- High quality clips and editing: I sort of get that; the thing is just that no matter what I do, I don't have more than 35 GB of free space, so I will *have* to compromise on quality (or buy a new hard drive, which, at the moment, is a *bit* more of a commitment to vidding than I am ready to make).

Re: Jerky playback

[tazey.livejournal.com]

Chasa has good advice and info.

Huffyuv is for editing not playback. If Premiere plays it fine, then don't worry about the video players not being able to keep up.

Since, I suppose, you're remastering your vid, try to only take what you need to conserve disk space. Don't bother encoding the sound part if you won't use it. Also, it's easier on the system to have the clip files on a disk other than the system disk. Less clogging through the bus system.

Re: Jerky playback

[hmpf.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I'd already decided only to take pretty much exactly what I needed (as closely as I could tell, anyway) from the eps and convert it with Huffyuv. I'd even already found out how to remove the sound; that only makes the files a tiny little bit smaller, though - and even if I just take the clips I need I will still quite possibly need more space than I have (I've deleted some stuff, so now I have 35 GB of free space).

Unfortunately I do not have two disk drives, and no partitions, either. I *have* been thinking about reinstalling my system for a while now, and *would* probably partition my disk before I do so, but I don't think I want to do that before I continue working on my vid... I'm not sure I'll be able to reinstall everything so it will work (I'm pretty inexperienced when it comes to computer stuff, though now that my 'personal computer specialist' has moved to Australia, I will have to learn to do things on my own), so I'd rather work with what I have.

Re: Jerky playback

[tazey.livejournal.com]

What resolution are you using?

When I used Huffyuv before, on an older system, I went for half of the original resolution. Nowadays, people manage to stay at or near full resolution but that's really space hungry. Using external hard drives of 250Go is pretty average stuff for vidders.

Re: Jerky playback

[hmpf.livejournal.com]

I can change the resolution? Hmm..... have to find out how...

I *wish* I could afford an external har drive. Or a larger internal one, whatever. As it is, even the second-hand 100 GB one I have at the moment I only got sometime last year, from a friend. Before that, I had something like 20 GB, and didn't even dare to *dream* of vidding, although I always had vid bunnies. *g*

Re: Jerky playback

[tazey.livejournal.com]

I can change the resolution? Hmm..... have to find out how...

Check the filters in Virtualdub. There's one called Resize.

As it is, even the second-hand 100 GB one I have at the moment I only got sometime last year, from a friend. Before that, I had something like 20 GB, and didn't even dare to *dream* of vidding

I made "Right here, right now" on 4GB of space. Thankfully, I didn't have gazillion clips in it. *g*

100GB is a good start. If on your next system install, you can partition it, try to do so.

4 GB?

[hmpf.livejournal.com]

Wow.

Actually, the main problem with my previous system wasn't so much the size of the hard drive as the fact that the processor was kind of prehistoric. *g*

Re: 4 GB?

[tazey.livejournal.com]

Yep, 4GB and a 966 Mhz processor that sometimes lagged a little so while I watched the vid, I'd need to pause it every 20 seconds or so to let the sound catch up with the video and make sure it synched up correctly on key moments. Fun times. ;)

Actually, I didn't mind the lack of space and technical limitations, it forced me to think ahead and figure out where I was going before starting at all.

My previous processor was a 600 MHz one.

[hmpf.livejournal.com]

And not even a Pentium. Yep, I was using that still in 2005. I've given it to a friend now - the entire computer - to replace her even more prehistoric one (300something MHz! And her hard drive's so small it's constantly full, and you can hear her computer 'thinking'. *g*)

Re: My previous processor was a 600 MHz one.

[tazey.livejournal.com]

Which reminds me of another thing: how much RAM do you have?

256 MB.

[hmpf.livejournal.com]

I have another 256 MB stick I could put in, but I'm a bit wary of that one as the last time I put it in my computer it crashed a lot more often than it does now. It's - like almost everything in my computer - a second-hand component, and it was stored very improperly (in a plastic bag with several other components, with no kind protection), so my 'personal computer specialist' said that quite possibly it had become damaged while in storage, and could be the cause of my system's instability.

Still, I suppose I could put it back in just for a day or two and see how it goes. Can't really hurt, after all. If it keeps crashing my system I'll just take it out again...

(Did I mention my processor's also damaged? It's a bit of a miracle that it works at all: one of the corners is chipped!)

Re: 256 MB.

[tazey.livejournal.com]

Well, it's a toss. 512MB would help for vidding but it might be at the expense of an already fragile system.

In those conditions, I think you should consider encoding at half resolution with a high-end codec that won't get Premiere to crash. I find that better than encoding at full resolution with a crappy codec. Cut up your clips so that the files don't get over 200-300MB, that'll help with the RAM. If you need two different bits of the same scene, make two different clips.

And don't forget to set the auto-save project at a short interval. *g*

Gaaaaaah. Too many options!

[hmpf.livejournal.com]

VirtualDub is not my friend.

Okay... found the filters, but it just occurred to me that I have no idea what the original size of the source is. I feel so stupid. I'm sure there must be a very obvious way to find out...

Also: when rendering/recompressing/converting, do I use 'full processing mode' or 'normal recompress' or what? I only seem to be able to use the filters in full processing mode; they're unavailable for 'normal recompress'.

Also... do I need to pay any attention to things like bitrate... interlacing... etc.? I'm reading the marvelous AMV guide at the moment, but it's a bit confusing at times...

(You'll get a credit in my vid for technical assistance, I think! *g*)

Re: Gaaaaaah. Too many options!

[tazey.livejournal.com]

I'm sure there must be a very obvious way to find out...

File --> File information

You'll find out about the frame rate, I'm guessing it'll be 25fps. You'll also know the video and audio codecs, as well as image resolution. Check all your files to see if they're on the same specs.

when rendering/recompressing/converting, do I use 'full processing mode'

Yes.

to things like bitrate... interlacing... etc.? I'm reading the marvelous AMV guide at the moment, but it's a bit confusing at times...

Yes, it is. I could direct you toward AMV's Avisynth for resizing and re-encoding but, for what you have to do, Virtualdub itself will do just fine. I've only just started pottering around with Avisynth and I'm not yet convinced by the advantages. Apparently, I will be one day. *g*

For interlacing, it depends on where your source comes from. Bitrate is irrelevant with Huffyuv but it'll be when you'll encode your final file for web distribution.

[marvthegrate.livejournal.com]

The only real solution regarding storage would be to get additional storage space. Video work requires a great deal of space on the hdd. I'd look at an external USB drive or firewire if you have it.

Hmm, I was hoping for a codec that would produce smaller files!

[hmpf.livejournal.com]

That *has* to be possible. After all, people were vidding already a few years ago when computers just didn't *have* the huge amounts of storage they have today, and I'm using an old editing software, as well - shouldn't it be possible to find a somewhat older, yet still good enough codec? I only want to produce a fanvideo, after all - I don't really *need* brilliant, hyper-sharp images. The vid will be compressed to something around 20 MB in the end, so the quality won't be *that* great, anyway... it seems excessive to use clips whose sizes range from 400 MB to 4 GB for that.